OT: Bush Energy Policy… a crock

Question:

>     EPA Holds Back Report on Car Fuel Efficiency >     By Danny Hakim >     The New York Times >     Thursday 28 July 2005

[snip] >     Releasing the report this week would have been inopportune for the Bush > administration, its critics said, because it would have come on the eve of > a final vote in Congress on energy legislation six years in the making. The > bill, as it stands, largely ignores auto mileage regulations.

[snip] That paragraph above, is all the explanation needed. It seems as if GWB’s administration fully expects us all to bend over and take it for the next few years.  Because every time you turn around, there’s another one of his croanies ready to ram it in. If we could only get the busheviks to get off their friggin’ knees and stop encouraging this sort of behavior, we might be able to salvage things….before it’s too late. Mike

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  Whoops, forgot to mention this…. I’m sure everyone has heard by now that the oil companies have been enjoying "record profits", due to the high prices at the gas pump. Typically, in the past, a good chunk of these profits would have been used to pay for exploration and research. However, that’s not the case this time. No….this time they’re simply swimming in the cash. So….by the GWB admin. pushing an energy bill that does nothing to increase fuel efficiency or explore alternative "renewable" fuels, they’re making sure these record profits will continue for a looooong time.  In other words, they’re taking care of their buddies!! Think about that the next time you fill up!! Mike

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not only swimming in cash from, we just gave them billions and billions in welfare dollars.

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courageously avow: >not only swimming in cash from, we just gave them billions and billions >in welfare dollars.

Damn you socialists.  Next thing you know you’ll be a welfare state. Ken Wilson Posting from the last bastion of freedom and democracy. Proud Owner of Lord Valve, Paul Knowles, PMG, John Wheaton, Claude Lucas  and the rest of the Union of Rightwing Idiots Needing Explanations (URINE) Former owner of gtski, traded to Elvis Kabong for a half-eaten twinkie  and an old stub from a Mom & Dads concert. www.resisters.ca

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they BELIEVE in their leaders wheooo wheeooo wheooo "relax, you are growing very sleepy"

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> they BELIEVE in their leaders wheooo wheeooo

wheooo "relax, you are > growing very sleepy"

That "wheoo" thing. Is that supposed to be the sound of a Theremin like on a sci-fi flick?

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The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the operating system level…and possibly some applications too. It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more regularly, it could become an annoyance.

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in message > The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* > computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the > operating system level…and possibly some applications too. > It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very > widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another > arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. > It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big

guys include this patch > in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation > date…but they may not.  There are folks who

are running unsupported > levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for > a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert

conspiracy theory here.) > If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more > regularly, it could become an annoyance.

Aren’t there 3 states that refuse to comply to daylight savings time? I wonder if Arizona, Indiana and Hawaii will refuse or not. Wouldn’t blame them if they said NO WAY! From what I read statistically the first week of daylight savings time every year results in more car crashes than any other time of the year usually during morning rush hour. Evidently people are falling asleep at the wheel from having to adjust to the totally unnecessary "new" schedule. Sheeks I just get used to not even needing a wake up alarm, then the so-called daylight savings goes into effect. All that needs to be done is for employers to ask workers to vote for what time they want to come in and leave. Every business doesn’t need to only operate between 8 to 5. The days get longer by themselves in the summer anyway.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >regularly, it could become an annoyance.

NTP is your friend…. Claude

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >regularly, it could become an annoyance. > NTP is your friend….

I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination issues with NTP and the timing of the change. Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed").

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>regularly, it could become an annoyance. > NTP is your friend…. >I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed").

I dunno. Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly. I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot. Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day. There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO the computing infrastructure isn’t one… It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new? Claude

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I vote we follow in Arizona’s footsteps – no daylight savings, not now not ever. If you want to get up earlier, by god, just do it. Remember Nixon??? Didn’t we have a year or two of daylight savings???? and 55 MPH? What energy does daylight savings save? You get up in the dark so you turn on the light, if you get up in the light, you go home in the dark and you turn on the light. The light is on – on one end of the day or the other. Daylight Saving Time, for the U.S. and its territories, is NOT observed in Hawaii, American Samoa, Guam, Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands, most of the Eastern Time Zone portion of the State of Indiana, and the state of Arizona (not the Navajo Indian Reservation, which does observe). Navajo Nation participates in the Daylight Saving Time policy, due to its large size and location in three states.

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The idea of daylight saving time was first put into practice by the German government during the First World War between April 30 and October 1, 1916. Shortly afterward, the United Kingdom followed suit, first adopting DST between May 21 and October 1, 1916. Then on March 19, 1918, the U.S. Congress established several time zones (which were already in use by railroads and most cities since 1883) and made daylight saving time official (which went into effect on March 31) for the remainder of World War I. It was observed for seven months in 1918 and 1919. The law, however, proved so unpopular (mostly because people rose and went to bed earlier than in modern times) that the law was later repealed. Daylight saving time was reinstated in the United States on February 9, 1942, again as a wartime measure to conserve resources, this time in order to fight World War II. This remained in effect until the war began winding down and the requirement was removed on September 30, 1945. >From 1945 to 1966, U.S. federal law did not address daylight saving

time. States and localities were free to observe daylight saving time or not. This resulted in a patchwork where some areas observed DST and adjacent areas did not, and it was not unheard of to have to reset one’s clock several times during a relatively short trip (e.g., bus drivers operating between Moundsville, West Virginia, and Steubenville, Ohio had to reset their watches seven times over 35 miles). The U.S. federal Uniform Time Act of 1966 mandated that daylight saving time begin nationwide on the last Sunday of April and end on the last Sunday of October. Any state that wanted to be exempt from daylight saving time could do so by passing a state law, provided that it exempt the entire state. The law was amended in 1972 to permit states that straddle a time zone boundary to exempt the entire area of the state lying in one time zone. The law was amended again in 1986 to begin daylight saving time on the first Sunday in April, to take effect the following year. In response to the 1973 energy crisis, daylight saving in the United States was begun earlier in both 1974 and 1975, commencing on the first Sunday in January in the former year and the last Sunday in February in the latter. On July 21, 2005 the U.S. House of Representatives and U.S. Senate agreed to a compromise bill that would extend DST by one month. Daylight saving time would begin three weeks earlier (on the second Sunday of March) and end on the first Sunday of November. The House had previously approved a motion that would have extended DST for two months. The extension was criticized by the airline industry [3], by observant Jews [4], and by persons concerned for the safety of children traveling to school in the dark before the later sunrise [5]. [edit] Rationales for DST One of the major reasons given for observing DST in the United States is energy conservation. Theoretically, the amount of residential electricity needed in the evening hours is dependent both on when the sun sets and when people go to bed. Because people tend to observe the same bedtime year-round, by artificially moving sunset one hour later, the amount of energy used is theoretically reduced. United States Department of Transportation studies showed that DST reduces the country’s electricity usage by one percent during each day DST is in effect. Part of the reason that it is normally observed in the late spring, summer, and early autumn is because during the winter months the amount of energy saved by moving sunset one hour later is negated by the increased need for morning lighting by moving sunrise by the same amount. During the summer most people would wake up after the sun rises, regardless of whether daylight saving time is in effect or not, so there is no increased need for morning lighting to offset the afternoon energy savings. Another perceived benefit of DST is increased opportunities for outdoor activities. Most people plan outdoor activities during the increased hours of sunlight. Other benefits cited include prevention of traffic injuries (by allowing more people to return home from work or school in daylight), and crime reduction (by reducing people’s risk of being targets of crimes that are more common in dark areas). When the U.S. went on extended DST in 1974 and 1975 in response to the 1973 energy crisis, Department of Transportation studies found that observing DST in March and April saved 10,000 barrels of oil a day, and prevented about 2,000 traffic injuries and 50 fatalities saving about U.S. $28 million in traffic costs. [6] [edit] Criticism of DST DST is not universally accepted; many localities do not observe it. Opponents claim that there is not enough benefit to justify needing to adjust clocks twice every year. The disruption in sleep patterns associated with setting clocks forward, and thereby "losing" an hour, correlates with a spike in the number of severe auto accidents, as well as emotional trauma and lost productivity as tired workers adjust to the schedule change. It is also noted that much effort is spent reminding everyone twice a year of the change, and thousands are inconvenienced by showing up at the wrong time when they forget. There is also a question whether the savings in lighting costs justifies the increase in summertime air conditioning costs. While most people use more sunlight under DST, most people also experience more heat, which prompts many people to turn on the air conditioner during the warmer afternoon hours. When air conditioning was not widely available, the change did save energy; however, air conditioning is much more widespread now than it was several decades ago. Air conditioning often uses more energy than artificial lighting. No formal studies have been performed, but an enormous amount of time has been spent by software developers to deal with the fact that 2400 hours past 2pm is not necessarily 2pm 100 days later. DST is particularly unpopular among people working in agriculture because the animals do not observe it, and thus the people are placed out of synchronization with the rest of the community, including school times, broadcast schedules, and the like. Canadian author Robertson Davies, in The Diary of Samuel Marchbanks (1947), wrote the following: "I object to being told that I am saving daylight when my reason tells me that I am doing nothing of the kind … At the back of the Daylight Saving scheme, I detect the bony, blue-fingered hand of Puritanism, eager to push people into bed earlier, and get them up earlier, to make them healthy, wealthy, and wise in spite of themselves." [edit] DST and the state of Indiana DST is a long-standing controversy in Indiana, not only as an agricultural state, but also because the border separating the eastern and central time zones divides the state. In the past, neighboring communities sometimes ended up one or even two hours apart. Being out-of-sync with neighboring states and the national changing of clocks, it is argued, has a negative economic impact on the state. It has been demonstrated that some businesses have located outside of the state once the confusion related to not changing clocks is discovered. In the current compromise, the state has three kinds of time zones: 77 counties, most of the state, are on Eastern Standard Time but do not use DST; 5 counties near Chicago, Illinois and 5 counties in the southwestern corner of the state are on Central Standard Time and do use DST; and 2 counties near Cincinnati, Ohio and 3 counties near Louisville, Kentucky are on Eastern Standard time but do observe DST. Their observance of DST is unofficial in this case, as a strict reading of the Uniform Time Act would not allow for this situation, but by observing DST, they remain synchronized with the greater Louisville and Cincinnati metropolitan areas. On April 29, 2005, the Indiana legislature voted to begin observing Daylight Saving Time in 2006; however, what time zone the state will be placed in is unknown pending federal hearings [7].

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>>regularly, it could become an annoyance. >>NTP is your friend…. >I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed"). > I dunno. > Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly.

Been a while since I monitored a system syncing up to NTP… but IIRC, it took a while to sync…pretty sure it was more than a few minutes. > I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot.

Why do you have to do it in cron? Can’t you just do it continually through NTP? Works great for me. > Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, > the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day.

Yes, but…all operating systems (maybe except RTOSs) have *already* built in logic that changes the time for the existing daylight savings time…it does this instantly.  That is the logic that needs to change. Today we don’t just let NTP sync for DST…and if the current DST logic isn’t changed, we’d be looking at 4 times a year when the local time differs by an hour, and needs to sync to NTP…which ain’t the way to do it, all due respect. > There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO > the computing infrastructure isn’t one…

I believe there will be patches to fix the automated changeover. Hopefully it’s included in regular maintenance over the next few months. Linux will probably have the patch built in to a distro sometime…later today > It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new?

LOL!  They’ll supply patches, but it’ll probably create another toolbar you can’t get rid of, or "Clippy" will be showing up asking questions about your OS auth key or something. What’s the odds on a DST patch for my vintage Win98SE?

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> The idea of daylight saving time w<snip>

Honey, we all have Google…’nkay? Go make a shoe or something.

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>> The idea of daylight saving time w<snip> >Honey, we all have Google…’nkay? >Go make a shoe or something.

What?  You stepped in it again and you want new shoes?  Try licking it off.  No shoes for you, one year. Ken Wilson Posting from the last bastion of freedom and democracy. Proud Owner of Lord Valve, Paul Knowles, PMG, John Wheaton, Claude Lucas  and the rest of the Union of Rightwing Idiots Needing Explanations (URINE) Former owner of gtski, traded to Elvis Kabong for a half-eaten twinkie  and an old stub from a Mom & Dads concert. www.resisters.ca

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Just be glad she can’t eMail you directly. Yeeech. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>The idea of daylight saving time w<snip> >Honey, we all have Google…’nkay? >Go make a shoe or something. > What?  You stepped in it again and you want new shoes?  Try licking it > off.  No shoes for you, one year. > Ken Wilson > Posting from the last bastion of freedom and democracy. > Proud Owner of Lord Valve, Paul Knowles, PMG, John Wheaton, Claude Lucas >  and the rest of the Union of Rightwing Idiots Needing Explanations (URINE) > Former owner of gtski, traded to Elvis Kabong for a half-eaten twinkie >  and an old stub from a Mom & Dads concert. > www.resisters.ca

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>>>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>>>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>>>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>>>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>>>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>>>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>>>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>>>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>>>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>>>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>>>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>>>regularly, it could become an annoyance. >>>NTP is your friend…. >>I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >>Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >>change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >>issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >>Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >>NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >>Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >>Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >>will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed"). > I dunno. > Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly. >Been a while since I monitored a system syncing up to NTP… >but IIRC, it took a while to sync…pretty sure it was >more than a few minutes. > I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot. >Why do you have to do it in cron? Can’t you just do it >continually through NTP? Works great for me.

I don’t *have* to. I just added an hourly run of ntpd as a client to my crontabs I use my ISP as a time source. I don’t have a need to run an on site time-server, but it’s not that difficult. > Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, > the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day. >Yes, but…all operating systems (maybe except RTOSs) have *already* >built in logic that changes the time for the existing daylight savings >time…it does this instantly.  That is the logic that needs to change.

Yeah, but that gets overridden by the clock updates. >Today we don’t just let NTP sync for DST…and if the current DST >logic isn’t changed, we’d be looking at 4 times a year when the local >time differs by an hour, and needs to sync to NTP…which ain’t the >way to do it, all due respect.

I’ve never had any problems. The cutover is usually at 2:00 AM local time and I fire my time syncs at a minute after the hour anyway. The loss of that bit of accuracy in the middle of the night isn’t critical to me. At least, I’ve never heard any complaints > There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO > the computing infrastructure isn’t one… >I believe there will be patches to fix the automated changeover. >Hopefully it’s included in regular maintenance over the next few >months. Linux will probably have the patch built in to a distro >sometime…later today

I’m sure any needed changes will be made as part of regular maintenance updates for all the industrial grade OSes. > It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new? >LOL!  They’ll supply patches, but it’ll probably create another >toolbar you can’t get rid of, or "Clippy" will be showing up >asking questions about your OS auth key or something. >What’s the odds on a DST patch for my vintage Win98SE?

I’m pretty sure that’s already mostly deprecated by MS, but I still get patches for my Win98SE from Windows Update. I don’t leave that machine on, anyway, and the clock drifts so badly in it I installed a NTP client to sync it when I boot it… Claude

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why change your personal computer time to DST? Arizona doesn’t and somehow their computers manage to function. If you run a bank computer, well OK, you won’t want to lose a penny’s interest, but for an ordinary personal computer it really doesn’t matter what time or date it’s set. Even our time employee time clock computer – as long as it measures the length of the time worked, it doesn’t matter if it’s DST or EST or PST. Sometimes I don’t bother to change clocks to DST, we just come to work at eight instead of nine. DST is just a card trick. Why conform to nonsense? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>>>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>>>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>>>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>>>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>>>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>>>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>>>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>>>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>>>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>>>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>>>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>>>regularly, it could become an annoyance. >>>NTP is your friend…. >>I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >>Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >>change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >>issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >>Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >>NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >>Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >>Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >>will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed"). > I dunno. > Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly. > Been a while since I monitored a system syncing up to NTP… > but IIRC, it took a while to sync…pretty sure it was > more than a few minutes. > I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot. > Why do you have to do it in cron? Can’t you just do it > continually through NTP? Works great for me. > Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, > the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day. > Yes, but…all operating systems (maybe except RTOSs) have *already* > built in logic that changes the time for the existing daylight savings > time…it does this instantly.  That is the logic that needs to change. > Today we don’t just let NTP sync for DST…and if the current DST > logic isn’t changed, we’d be looking at 4 times a year when the local > time differs by an hour, and needs to sync to NTP…which ain’t the > way to do it, all due respect. > There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO > the computing infrastructure isn’t one… > I believe there will be patches to fix the automated changeover. > Hopefully it’s included in regular maintenance over the next few > months. Linux will probably have the patch built in to a distro > sometime…later today > It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new? > LOL!  They’ll supply patches, but it’ll probably create another > toolbar you can’t get rid of, or "Clippy" will be showing up > asking questions about your OS auth key or something. > What’s the odds on a DST patch for my vintage Win98SE?

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> why change your personal computer time to DST? Arizona doesn’t and > somehow their computers manage to function. If you run a bank computer, > well OK, you won’t want to lose a penny’s interest, but for an ordinary > personal computer it really doesn’t matter what time or date it’s set. > Even our time employee time clock computer – as long as it measures the > length of the time worked, it doesn’t matter if it’s DST or EST or PST. > Sometimes I don’t bother to change clocks to DST, we just come to work > at eight instead of nine. DST is just a card trick. > Why conform to nonsense?

Look, Honey…an authoratative, accurate date and time is important in all kinds of technical environments. You run your business off of a rooster and a sundial and it works for you…fine. Please accept my invitation to further simplify your life and get rid of your PC. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->>>>>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>>>>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>>>>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>>>>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>>>>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>>>>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>>>>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>>>>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>>>>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>>>>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>>>>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>>>>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>>>>regularly, it could become an annoyance. >>>>NTP is your friend…. >>>I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >>>Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >>>change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >>>issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >>>Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >>>NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >>>Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >>>Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >>>will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed"). >>I dunno. >>Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly. >Been a while since I monitored a system syncing up to NTP… >but IIRC, it took a while to sync…pretty sure it was >more than a few minutes. >>I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot. >Why do you have to do it in cron? Can’t you just do it >continually through NTP? Works great for me. >>Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, >>the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day. >Yes, but…all operating systems (maybe except RTOSs) have *already* >built in logic that changes the time for the existing daylight savings >time…it does this instantly.  That is the logic that needs to change. >Today we don’t just let NTP sync for DST…and if the current DST >logic isn’t changed, we’d be looking at 4 times a year when the local >time differs by an hour, and needs to sync to NTP…which ain’t the >way to do it, all due respect. >>There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO >>the computing infrastructure isn’t one… >I believe there will be patches to fix the automated changeover. >Hopefully it’s included in regular maintenance over the next few >months. Linux will probably have the patch built in to a distro >sometime…later today >>It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new? >LOL!  They’ll supply patches, but it’ll probably create another >toolbar you can’t get rid of, or "Clippy" will be showing up >asking questions about your OS auth key or something. >What’s the odds on a DST patch for my vintage Win98SE?

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> Look, Honey…an authoratative, accurate date and time is important in > all kinds of technical environments. > You run your business off of a rooster and a sundial and it works for > you…fine. > Please accept my invitation to further simplify your life and get rid > of your PC.

I subscribed to AGA to read about guitar amps and this fucking bitch is flooding the group with her idiotic shit.  She’s a total fucking waste of bandwidth. It’s time to flush this fucking stupid sperm toilet!

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Look, Honey…an authoratative, accurate date and time is important in > all kinds of technical environments. > You run your business off of a rooster and a sundial and it works for > you…fine. > Please accept my invitation to further simplify your life and get rid > of your PC. > I subscribed to AGA to read about guitar amps and this > fucking bitch is flooding the group with her idiotic > shit.  She’s a total fucking waste of bandwidth. > It’s time to flush this fucking stupid sperm toilet!

You’re a charming one, aren’t you?  Use your filter and wash out your mouth with some soap while you’re at it.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> why change your personal computer time to DST? Arizona doesn’t and > somehow their computers manage to function. If you run a bank computer, > well OK, you won’t want to lose a penny’s interest, but for an ordinary > personal computer it really doesn’t matter what time or date it’s set. > Even our time employee time clock computer – as long as it measures the > length of the time worked, it doesn’t matter if it’s DST or EST or PST. > Sometimes I don’t bother to change clocks to DST, we just come to work > at eight instead of nine. DST is just a card trick. > Why conform to nonsense? > Look, Honey…an authoratative, accurate date and time is important in > all kinds of technical environments. > You run your business off of a rooster and a sundial and it works for > you…fine. > Please accept my invitation to further simplify your life and get rid > of your PC. >>>>>>The daylight savings time change means that virtually *every* >>>>>>computer system will need to be patched or upgraded at the >>>>>>operating system level…and possibly some applications too. >>>>>>It’s not Y2K by a long shot, but it will be a moderate but very >>>>>>widespread effort to make it go smoothly.  And it will be another >>>>>>arbitrary project overlayed on IT depts scheduled work. >>>>>>It will cost money to do it…hopefully the big guys include this patch >>>>>>in regular maintenance releases between now and the implementation >>>>>>date…but they may not.  There are folks who are running unsupported >>>>>>levels of operating systems and applications who might be in for >>>>>>a little $urprise.  "I can’t patch it?" (Insert conspiracy theory here.) >>>>>>If Congress decides to fiddle with daylight savings time more >>>>>>regularly, it could become an annoyance. >>>>>NTP is your friend…. >>>>I agree, *but* if this is implemented back-asswards (imagine the >>>>Govt doing something technically back-asswards )and the first >>>>change is on the Fall Back side….there could be coordination >>>>issues with NTP and the timing of the change. >>>>Time going 1 hour backwards ain’t kind to applications. >>>>NTP takes (maybe) an a half hour to correct for an hour of clock error. >>>>Any way you slice it, NTP ain’t enough to fix this out of hand. >>>>Systems will have to be patched, and out-of-support OS and apps >>>>will be hit harder (i.e. "screwed"). >>>I dunno. >>>Reset the master clocks, the rest sync up fairly quickly. >>Been a while since I monitored a system syncing up to NTP… >>but IIRC, it took a while to sync…pretty sure it was >>more than a few minutes. >>>I sync my clocks once an hour with cron and on reboot. >>Why do you have to do it in cron? Can’t you just do it >>continually through NTP? Works great for me. >>>Most everything I see can already cope with Daylight Savings, >>>the bi-annual change is just gonna happen on a different day. >>Yes, but…all operating systems (maybe except RTOSs) have *already* >>built in logic that changes the time for the existing daylight savings >>time…it does this instantly.  That is the logic that needs to change. >>Today we don’t just let NTP sync for DST…and if the current DST >>logic isn’t changed, we’d be looking at 4 times a year when the local >>time differs by an hour, and needs to sync to NTP…which ain’t the >>way to do it, all due respect. >>>There be other issues with extending Daylight Savings, but IMO >>>the computing infrastructure isn’t one… >>I believe there will be patches to fix the automated changeover. >>Hopefully it’s included in regular maintenance over the next few >>months. Linux will probably have the patch built in to a distro >>sometime…later today >>>It might fuck up Windows, but what else is new? >>LOL!  They’ll supply patches, but it’ll probably create another >>toolbar you can’t get rid of, or "Clippy" will be showing up >>asking questions about your OS auth key or something. >>What’s the odds on a DST patch for my vintage Win98SE?

Please accept my invitation to use technology to filter out those with which you do not wish to communicate. I’m sure techno boy can manage that.

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> So….by the GWB admin. pushing an energy bill that does nothing to > increase fuel efficiency or explore alternative "renewable" fuels, they’re > making sure these record profits will continue for a looooong time.

That is factually NOT true. Here is the summary http://www.whitehouse.gov/energy/summaries.pdf Bye, John

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>> So….by the GWB admin. pushing an energy bill that does nothing to > increase fuel efficiency or explore alternative "renewable" fuels, they’re > making sure these record profits will continue for a looooong time. >That is factually NOT true. Here is the summary >http://www.whitehouse.gov/energy/summaries.pdf >Bye, >John

You are full of shit my little Turd Blossom. Ken Wilson Proud Owner of Lord Valve, Paul Knowles, PMG, John Wheaton, Claude Lucas,  Freep the Xenophobe, and the rest of the  Union of Rightwing Idiots Needing Explanations (URINE) Supporting the Troops at http://www.resisters.ca

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